As NATO leaders prepare to endorse a dramatic defense spending hike, Europe faces a reckoning: Where will the money come from — and will new tanks mean cuts to pensions?

Host Sarah Wheaton speaks with Michelle Haas, a defense analyst at Ghent University and an associate fellow at the Egmont Institute, about how the proposed 5 percent target is landing across the continent — and how countries are planning to fund the military buildup (or pretend to in order to placate Donald Trump).

Then, two politicians, one from the center right and the other from the center left, explain why they think the push goes too far. Sammy Mahdi — leader of Belgium’s Flemish Christian Democrats (CD&V), a party in the country’s governing coalition — calls the 5 percent goal “crazy.” Ralf Stegner, a senior German Social Democrat, co-authored a provocative manifesto urging Chancellor Friedrich Merz to invest in diplomacy, not militarization.